College Water Polo Coach Salary, Louisville Home And Garden Show 2022, Articles S

For instance theres Lieutenant Thomas Ahern who was was performing a routine function (test) of his P320 when it fired at him without any force towards the trigger, resulting in the bullet impacting his left thigh.. Thats why the US Marines have Sigs. Anyway there was one good thing to come from those movies, The USS Vengeance. But that's not working in the P320, he said. It was at that point that I knew the gun had a design flaw. The use of a modified [SIG] P226 holster created an unsafe condition by allowing a foreign object to enter the holster, causing the unintended discharge.. Its not happening on your person without some catastrophic event. The more someone touches, loads, clears, cleans, holsters, un-holsters, or otherwise deals with their firearm, the higher the statistical likelihood that complacence kicks in. They didnt have to, but did. Pity that some of the most common reactions fall into two over simplistic categories: 1. One, the energy necessary to lift the striker-securing safety plunger may be insufficient due to a too-weak spring, or a too-light plunger, or some other design flaw, to reliably engage the plunger where it belongs. Before the madness SIGS were expensive. The P320 Voluntary Upgrade Program is a SIG SAUER initiative to upgrade P320 pistols at no additional cost . Wheee!!. The company didnt want to comment on any specific pending litigation for obvious reasons. abprototype.com can add the manual safety as well as add the notches in the grip frame. A shame but then no one was hurt. Over the top, hammy and with incredible choleric energy, but as he once said, when you trying to seriously sell a scene that has space ship with obvious carboard walls, christmas lights and a guy in a rubber gorilla suit with a plastic horn on its head, if you play it lowkey youre dead the audience is gonna focus on how cheesy it all is. Thats deflecting from the real issue. Stinking Lawyers and quota cops. Then Weve got to go 9mm Nato. And hasnt been nothing but looking for the holy grail since. 3) If the sear fails, there is the drop safety in the way of the striker. Hes talking about trial lawyers recruiting clients whove experienced negligent discharges with P320s and suing the gun manufacturer. The suit also cites other occurrences of "un-commanded" discharges with the 320 while holstered. Second, pardon us if were more than a little skeptical that the P320 in question or any other handgun fired when it was out of battery. He wanted to see how accurate the gun was, especially after the customer got it back after the voluntary upgrade. JTF-2 is the only unit in. Guess it hasnt dawned on them that: 1. The networks report didnt mention lawsuits filed by LEOs (or anyone else) against other gun makers claiming similar alleged design defects. Sounds like most of these cases were off-body carry. I wish nothing bad on anyone carrying regardless of brand. This gun had been voluntary upgraded. . The thing is, youd probably need to generate many Gs of force in both directions simultaneously. In this version, Bridge City Officer Brittany Hilton tells her story of what she says happened when her P320 discharged as she was carrying it in her purse in what appears to be a SERPA holster (which has had its own problems, but thats another story). COPYRIGHT 2021, THETRUTHABOUTGUNS.COM. I would trust the intelligence of a Gorilla in a zoo before any one in the Far Right. The problem with Sig is with their polymer pistols. Charlton posted to the online commercial forum Canadian Gun Nutz, describing the CBC News piece as inaccurate and promising SIG Sauer would release a statement. https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/dea-agent-lee-paige-still-wont-go-away/. The new Kirk does suck. Charlton, headquartered in Victoria, B.C., for comment on its original story, but neither responded. Ron Cohen ruined Kimber and now hes doing the same to SIG. What it likely means is that cops and other law enforcement officers carry and handle their guns far more often than the average Joe or Jane. He would have been booted after the first time, but being a cop comes with some special privileges. BTW it was HK that made the first polymer gun, Glock actually stole the idea for the G17 from them. Still waiting. Third, Glock has had problems, too. The SIG will be the shortest military contract for guns in history. Aug 25, 2021 pluong91 said: Hello all users that plan on making a P320 Accidental Discharge Threads -We love our P320's and have done the research when these articles and lawsuits came out, we don't need you to tell us, we have done our due diligence. It offers the quality and reliability of Sig Sauer, with a tried and true striker system and ingenious features that make it a novel gun. Bineau added the review is looking at so-called ancillary equipment (meaning the holster and other items) as one element of that broader investigation. The latest of these suits was filed last week in US District Court in Massachusetts. who sells them? Hey, Im glad theres somethings we agree on! My gun just went off! Ever since the internet went mainstream I have read about the Sigs decline. Kyle . But breaking news here, skippy. If the military was going to go cheap then they should have thrown Taurus into the mix. So even if, as the ambulance chaser claims, the striker leg could vibrate off of the sear face, it could not discharge unless the drop safety was also disengaged because the drop safety prevents movement of the striker sufficient to make the firing pin protrude from the breech face. Yes, conspiracy to defraud is a thing when ones @ss is on the line. And those are exactly the kinds of plaintiffs who happen to make up the vast majority of the lawsuits filed against SIG. I dont consider the drop-bang issue a failure and Sigs response was actually above any real need, except to perhaps deflect any easy wins for slime ambulance chasers I get that. Being highly trained doesnt eliminate stupidity. https://millsentertainment.smugmug.com/William-Shatner-The-Wrath-of-Khan With the 320, the striker is in full-cock position, and held there through the operation of the trigger sear and the positive striker-blocking safety. I carry one in my front pocket routinely. I call b-s on all these my gun magically went off. That said, I own multiple P320s, but all of them have the manual safety due to personal preference. Liberal, Conservative. selling the 365 with strikers breaking? The 1911 had one added, the FN 1905 had one added in 1906. To make the striker leg pull off of the sear, you would have to impart a lot of rearward momentum and stop it suddenly. I own Serpa holsters in multiple configurations (1911, Beretta 96, H&K, Springfield, etc) for most of the time theyve been around and I NEVER had an ND. For the moron Neanderthals of the Far Right who will scream its the operators fault and we do not give a shit about marketing more safer designed weapons, if such idiotic polices were followed for other consumer goods today we would not have safety glass, anti-lock breaks, back up safeties, child proof medicine caps and chemical bottles, back up cameras, kick back muzzles on chain saws and the list goes on and on. Without a loser pays tort system, such abuse will go on and on. It provides another example of how the gun free zone purportedly keeps people safe by not only keeping guns away, but by requiring more discharges nearby. In 1982 the G17 hit the market and in 1983 they gave 30,000 pistols to the Austrian military at cost. Ive seen similar situations at our Municipal range. This is the only post fix tale of p320 failure I have heard that is not some form of but it just went off, I didnt do nutthin! In 2020, the agent, who is a former marine, was doing his routine training with the P320. The cheap seats were $100-$200 and you got to watch Wrath of Khan with Shatner. L. LRRifleman . Back in 2017, SIG instituted a voluntary upgrade program to replace the original production triggers with new enhanced triggers designed to fix the issue that we and others observed when the pistols were dropped onto hard surfaces. Trust a P365 with your life. The pistol is popular with commercial gun owners and law enforcement south of the border. Then theres the fact that the branches of the military have put the P320 design through their own batteries of testing and found it duty worthy. Going on Sigs reputation I bought a P320. And yes, if I pulled some of those stunts, Id have my membership revoked. The truth is the absolute WORST semi-autos that Sig, H&K, Walther, Beretta or Glock makes today are more reliable than the best semi-autos made 40 years ago, by far. LOL! But as Officer Hilton says, There is no way anything could have gotten into my purseinto the trigger guard and pulled that trigger., This ABC report includes an interview with Joshua Harrison, a firearms expert hired by the network to examine the P320s design and give his opinion of its safety. Good job! Sigs suck and my Glock is awesome!. That show with no Shatner-Kirk and only a Nimoy-Spock wouldnt have gotten past the first season. The Collette suit, for example, lists 39 such discharges, all but five of which involved law enforcement officers. SIG just cannot seem to make a striker fired pistol that doesnt have issues. The problem is non-existent. Harrison stated that, I have not seen enough to convince me that the upgraded version is dangerous., When ABCs David Scott asked Harrison if its a mystery whats going wrong with the updated version though Harrison had just stated the upgraded pistol isnt dangerous Harrison said, I do not have an explanation for why the updated version should have complaints from trained individuals. But when you set a gun down on a table, and the damn thing goes off seconds after you let go, that sounds like a defective gun. Which in and of itself is user error / misuse. That being the case, the 320 is a cocked and locked striker-fired gun; However, it only has two safeties, unlike, say, a 1911, which has four: An inertial firing pin, a positive firing-pin locking safety, a manual sear-locking/blocking safety, and a trigger-bar-blocking grip safety. Theres also an un-named Texas gun shop manager who says a P320 fired as he cleared the weapon, blowing off one of his fingers. Theres just too much other paraphernalia bouncing around in there. You arent a gunfighter, either. Sig Sauer's headquarters are located in New Hampshire at Pease International Tradeport. But SIG Sauer said it has rectified the issue with upgrades, including one made for the U.S. military which court documents, filed as part of one of the lawsuits, show resulted in substantial changes to the weapons internal design. It sounds the same as arguing whether Captain Marvel could beat Superman up in a fist fight its pretty absurd and laughable. On Thursday, M.D. (b) An offense under this section is a Class A misdemeanor. A lot like carrying a cocked and locked 1911 but with the safety off. If these same folks were around in the 80s and got their way, no one today would know what a Glock was. The suit mirrors lawsuits filed across the country involving the semi-automatic gun known as the P320. I lost $200 on a gun that had less then 1000 rounds through it but I could care. This guy had been working at the LGS for over a decade and never had an AD or ND, he was the strictest when it came to safety. So, unlike the Serpa holster debate, Im a believer that there is more going on than meets the eye with the P320 and is exactly why I refrained from buying one, why I still wont own one, and why I steer people away from it. Some of the plaintiffs claim the pistol can fire without the trigger even being touched. At the risk of sounding superstitious lets review Sigs latest turd pistol. NO, SIG has a problem that they would rather fight in court. He points to it in the video. Frankly, I think that ship is the best looking sci-fi ship design ever, with the Excelsior a very close second. You would have to conclude theres a problem with the product, not with the people., In the Nightline version, Bagnell says, Firearms are not subject to federal regulation. How about something more relevant. how do I get one for my P320? 01:10. It sure wasnt her fault though, because she was flooring the. They mandate more discharges, with more property damage, more injuries, and more deaths. Withe the P320 Sigs contract was $169.5 million, $103 million cheaper then Glock. Mine is very accurate. Much has been made of Nimoys Spock being the most popular character in TOS, but Id argue that without Shatners over-the-top swagger and brash manner, the balance would be lost. That is the point of most of the video at the end of the article. Everyone knows Glocks are the absolute pinnacle of perfection and have never had one single defect ever! Wow new finger grooves, crazy innovation. The modular SIG P320 is among the most widely-owned handguns on the planet. It was one of the first ones and was sent back as a voluntary upgrade. UPDATE:We were just made aware of YouTuber BoomStick Tactical who produced this video the day before our post published. The current allegations, then, are different, claiming that the P320 is prone to un-commanded discharges.. Im more of a DS9 guy. So I will just continue to carry Mexican style with my striker fired polymer wonder nine from a company that may or may not be SIG. Really? By hoping Sig gets taken down for the P320, theyre actually setting up their own pet brand to be the next on the chopping block. . (c) If conduct constituting an offense under this section also constitutes an offense under another . There are tens of millions of gun owners, far more than there are cops, and the VAST majority of those folks buy their guns and drop them a nightstand drawer or up on a closet shelf and leave it until theyre needed. They suck and Im awesome!, 2. I could care but that came at the expense of reliability and safety. In my opinion, the only reason SIG would have done that is if they knew there was a safety problem with the original gun, otherwise they would not have done it., Scott says Harrison reviewed the claims in Officer Hiltons lawsuit and said, its unclear to (Harrison) what could now be causing misfires in the upgraded guns., Scott then asked Harrison if he believes the P320 should be removed from the marketplace. But it hardly indicts the P320 as a badly engineered weapon or that its worse than another brand. 1:07. Upgrades are for things that didnt work right in the first place. Id read that for TMP, they got NASA to help in the design of the refit Enterprise. With the redesign, you would have to implement a LOT of force to move the trigger backwards. While it seems that I have a preference for battle ships, The Romulans had Warbirds. Asking for a friend. Sep 20, 2021 613 571 Idaho. . Training and experience are not a talisman that magically prevents accidents. Cars have so many electronics these days, who knows what could have gone wrong! Just because someone shoots hyper-unrealistic 3 gun competition, subscribes to Recoil magazine and routinely watches their fave rave YouTube cult of personality channel shill for the latest company that paid him off doesnt make them a [emailprotected]$$. I just separate Shatner the man from Kirk the character, which he plays with Shakespearian operatic perfection. No Warp core, just a quantum singularity, The engine was basically a dorm fridge. It SHOULD have more engagement width wise, but often doesnt due to things being rounded or out of square. Whether or not the suits have merit. Had a buddy, years ago, that was a deputy for Orange County in California. Use a proper holster and follow other gun safety protocols. The drop-bang thing only happened at a very narrow event window, it was only once the Internet doom-preachers figured out that narrow window and did it over and over online did it appear to be a thing. Sig adapted and changed the pistol sufficiently to prevent even that issue. Note also that ABC didnt provide any context for the number of suits filed against SIG. Quite frankly, a sizable number of the LEOs that go there, would benefit from a Gun Safety 101 class. You did get to sit and watch it with him, which leads to a serious question. I would rather play handball with the Devil himself because if you deal with the Devil he will tell you that you agreed to lose your soul for a big box full of millions in cash. Not only is it now the designated sidearm of all branches of the U.S. military, there are over a million of them in civilian hands. The military is already shopping for a new sidearm. It has nothing to do with Glock. Jeff Bagnell, a lawyer in Westport, Conn., who has litigated 10 cases, mostly by commercial gun owners, related to SIG P320 misfires across several U.S. states, took note of the accident involving the Canadian special forces soldier. You need a lead that can be the lightening rod and not be afraid to make an ass of themselvesit give the watcher permission to take it seriously. This website has been messed up all week so that might be the problem in replying. The same should hold true for the insane marketing of pistols like the totally unsafe Glock. Yes, but that did not mean the machine would be able to go on being marketed like that. Its just dumb enough to sound like the plot to a damned Disney film. U.S. lawsuits D. Using an example from the first prong, we legitimately fault the user who shot himself in the palm, rightfully asking why in the WORLD his palm was in front of the muzzle when he set the gun down. . Slowly people are realizing they arent the only ones having issues. This is what happens when you go with the lowest bidder. So it never had a history of a potential valid claim for ambulance chasers to work off of. Sometimes you dont get what you pay for but now SIG has bragging rights. Too Many Accidents But hey, in ruthless, lawless, Capitalvania were life is considered cheap and expendable no one gives a shit, especially the Far Right that screams about abortions and then kills off the children that were not aborted with loaded guns laying around the house. The trigger bar has to push up on it, for it to release. Either one could have been a gun or a Barbie. This is this same company that couldnt build their own freaking rifles after multiple attempts (Sig SG550 series) when that rifle had been made in Switzerland for years without issue. Thats the American system at work in all its corrupt majesty. Bravo. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h-ZZ6pynGLM Anyway my question for $600 would be: Did you have your 3rd wife killed? That took a lot. These suits allege that their ultra-popular P320 pistol can fire without the trigger being pulled. Second, your claim that the military is dumping because theyre problematic? But now, P320 is the subject. As for the Serpa holster, this is a bunch of internet echo chamber BS that originated with Obama-era federal agencies putting a bad light on a good product in order to sway public opinion and thus damage the manufacturers bottom line. 1.A rush to market, and as usual the blind greed of the gun companies who no longer test pistols before marketing them think it is cheaper (so the idiots think) to let the public test them. Whats the difference between a $600 Sig and a $300 Taurus? With Biden spending outrageous amounts of money, whats 100 million here or there? You need to deliberately thumb the Pythons hammer back to get that trigger pull, each and every time. Holding the striker fully cocked with nothing to block it if the sear fails is questionable at best. I wont argue theyre wrong, I dont own one, dont want to. Theyve now come to the attention of the legacy media. Each incident gives them more blood for their macabre dance, and another tic-mark for their context-free gun violence tally. The round went downrange so nobody was hurt. Hilton's $15 million lawsuit said, "there have been 54 reported uncommanded discharges of the P320," meaning the gun went off by itself, over the last five years in 22 states and Washington, D.C. Sig Sauer did not respond to ABC News' request for comment. Canadas highly-trained counterterrorism force, JTF-2, is the only military unit with the SIG P320 in its inventory right now. I dont own a P320. When he put his hand on the grip, the weapon fired, according to the lawsuit. The heads up testing was immediately finished the Sig was the winner. After the accident the unit returned to using the SIG P226 they had planned to replace with the P320. Seems kind of like a Sig apologist article. Canadian Special Forces Command has not said what caused the gun to go off unexpectedly, but the company said a conclusion has been reached. Manual safeties on pistols, hammer and striker fired systems were found necessary as far back as 1900. This subject has two prongs; One is the negligence of those who have shot themselves with 320s through violations of Rule 2, the other the possible mechanical design failing of the gun. As for Seals they have their own contract with Glock but can carry anything they want. Theres still the P938 extractors snapping they refuse to acknowledge. My trust for Sig stopped after they produced the beloved Sig556xi Russian. He likens it to a bow-and-arrow, pulled taut. The real tell is that of all the cases, most are cops of some kind. Glock's and Sig P320 are all designated as Double-Action-Only fire control mechanisms. These cops seem pretty dang stupid if they put loaded guns in gym bags and purses with other stuff and carry them around, especially a gun that lacks manual safeties. Because its flat out bull**it. When he opened the drawer the hinges pulled the Charters trigger. The P320 should be scrapped and SIG Sauer USA should redesign a new pistol around the striker firing mechanism instead of just retrofitting a hammer fired pistol (P250). Im not even sure I would do that with my 92 or something else that can be both decocked and locked. Its also beyond debate that current production Sig quality is drastically inferior to what it once was, particularly the German made pieces. Combine this with the complacency that comes with handling a firearm over-and-over again as you holster and unholster a firearm throughout the day, its not surprising that many of these officers are saying it just went off as a negligent discharge can cost them their job if it lead to serious injury or property damage. Bagnell told TTAG that he believes the problem with the striker-fired P320 is an inadequate sear/striker connection (he has images he says illustrate this on his website). This is just blind greed using some careless doofus to sell a lie and cash in because a civil jury, like the average American voter, can be manipulated easily though emotion, tears and stories of anguish, pain and suffering at the foot of some super-rich evil corporations cold-blooded behest. Look a fanboy. The Hide Armory. Is it? Too much MIM in that crap SIG, the old ones were great. My bet would be that someone had a fully loaded gun in a gym bag and a cloth or rag snagged the trigger. Sig started out rough, but a lot of agencies have decided that their modular chassis system is the way of the future. At least the Gorilla is still evolving while the Far Right proved to be an evolutionary dead end, one of natures mistakes. Fourth, no one takes Taurus seriously. Bagnell also represented Virginia Sheriffs Deputy Marcie Vadnais who sued SIG when she said her P320 went off on its own when she was removing the weapon from her belt. Vadnais was featured in the Nightline version of ABCs report. So I give a ton of credit to Shatner for reading the reality of what it was and in essence, saving it.